Episode #41 Systems That Can Assist With Overwhelm with Donna Gilmour
This transcript is computer generated and may contain errors and not be an exact representation of the audio
Hi This is Welcome to Self® and I’m your host Dr Hayley D Quinn, fellow human, business owner, and coach for women like you who want to increase your own self-care and self-compassion, change the relationship you have with yourselves and your business and elevate your business to a new level so you can live the full and meaningful life you desire.
Welcome to Self® is a podcast for women business owners. It is a place where you can come and learn about the practices that will assist you as a business owner, get tips on how to engage in your business in a way that is sustainable for you, realise that you’re not alone in the ways that you struggle, and have your curiosity piqued on various topics as I chat to wonderful guests and bring you solo episodes.
This is a place to remember that you are human first and have different tasks in your business and different roles in your life that need your attention and for that you need to take care of yourself in the best way you can. This is a place of nourishment, growth and helpful information. A place where you can learn ways to assist you and your business to thrive.
I met my next guest during our undergraduate studies many years ago and from there we have formed a beautiful friendship and also support one another as business owners. Whilst she studied psychology her career took a different turn, and she is a brilliant bookkeeper, and a whizz when it comes to systems and strategies for business. Originally from Scotland, Donna Gilmour immigrated to Australia in 2002. She has a degree in Commerce with a Major in Accounting and an honours degree in Psychological Science from Griffith University in Brisbane. She is a Certified Bookkeeper, BAS Agent, Xero Advisor and a member of the Institute of Certified Bookkeepers, Australian Bookkeepers Network and Australian Accounting Technicians.
Her business Time n Space provides end-to-end Bookkeeping, BAS Services, and Business Advisory Services to small business owners that facilitate better financial and organisational outcomes.
As well as numbers and all things organisational, Donna is passionate about the psychological, physical and energetic impact of clutter on one’s mind in all areas of life, from work, to family, but is particularly interested in how this affects working environments.
Utilising cloud technology, apps and tools, she frames her core services from the business owner’s perspective with a key focus on streamlining and efficiencies to ensure her clients business thrives.
Donna is in touch with business operations at the grassroots level and brings 30 years experience and the latest technological solutions to streamline and simplify financial and administrative processes that save time and reduce costs.
I just know you’re going to get a lot out of this episode, so grab yourself a cuppa and a way to take notes and enjoy the episode. It is my absolute pleasure to invite my dear friend on to the podcast.
Hayley Quinn 0:04
Hi, this is welcome to self. And I’m your host Dr. Hayley de Quinn, fellow human, business owner, and coach for women like you who want to increase your self care and self compassion. Change the relationship you have with yourself in your business, and elevate your business to a new level so you can live the full meaningful life you desire.
Welcome to self is a podcast for Women Business Owners. It is a place where you can come and learn about the practices that will assist you as a business owner. get tips on how to engage in your business in a way that is sustainable for you. Realise that you’re not alone in the ways that you struggle, and have your curiosity piqued on various topics as I chat to wonderful guests and bring you solo episodes.
This is a place to remember that you’re human first, and have different tasks in your business, and different roles in your life that need your attention. And for that you need to take care of yourself in the best way you can. This is a place of nourishment, growth, and helpful information, a place where you can learn ways to assist you and your business to thrive.
Hi, and welcome to another episode and another great guest. If you enjoy this episode or any of the other episodes, I’d really love it if you would leave a rating and review. This is the best way for podcasts to reach a wider audience and get helpful information into the ears of more people.
I met my next guest during our undergraduate studies many years ago, and from there we have formed a beautiful friendship and also support one another as business owners. While she studied psychology, her career took a different turn. And she is a brilliant bookkeeper and a whiz when it comes to systems and strategies for business. Originally from Scotland, Donna Gilmore emigrated to Australia in 2002. She has a degree in commerce with a major in accounting and an honours degree in Psychological Science from Griffith University in Brisbane. She’s certified bookkeeper, bass agent, zero advisor, and a member of the Institute of Certified bookkeepers, Australian bookkeepers network and Australian accounting technicians. Her business time and space provides end to end bookkeeping, best services and business advisory services to small business owners that facilitate better financial and organisational outcomes.
As well as numbers and all things organisational. Donna is passionate about the psychological, physical and energetic impact of clutter on one’s mind in all areas of life from work to family. But he’s particularly interested in how this affects working environments. Utilising cloud technology, apps and tools. She frames her core services from the business owners perspective, with a key focus on streamlining and efficiencies to ensure her clients business thrives.
Donna is in touch with business operations at the grassroots level and brings 30 years experience and the latest technological solutions to streamline and simplify financial and administrative processes that save time and reduce costs. I just know you’re going to get a lot out of this episode. So grab yourself a cuppa and a way to take notes and enjoy the episode. It is my absolute pleasure to invite my dear friend on to the podcast
So hi, Donna, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. This is so lovely you and I’ve been friends for such a long time and it’s really really lovely to have you join me on the pod.
Donna Gilmour 3:59
Thank you so much Hayley, for having me on. You know, this is my very first podcast, man, I feel so grateful. And yeah, I just thank you so much for inviting me on. I’m excited. I’m a little bit nervous, but you know me, mother yet. I’m happy to be on and discuss systems and processes, I love them.
Hayley Quinn 4:22
Fantastic. And I’m very glad to be your first and it’s very lovely and I will take care of you I promise. Could we start with you telling us a little bit about yourself and what you do for your work roles?
Donna Gilmour 4:33
Yeah, sure. Well, I am a certified bookkeeper. I’m also a bass agent and business consultant. I run my practice from almost and the Redlands so really, you know I love bookkeeping, but I love helping small business owners with their financial management and Back in Business Administration operations. So we we help across six my clients across many different industries from Allied Health, which is one of my favourite industries to work in Belden construction. We help clients in the farming industry, retail industry, lot of trades, real estate, both residential and commercial real estate. So it’s quite varied in terms of the different industries that are working, but I love that I love that I love the variety, I guess, you know, bookkeeper, you know, a lot of the work that we actually do is end to end, but given past services, payroll, so we’ve got a payroll and HR compliance. And, you know, I just love all the financial aspects to it. So cash flow budget and services, but, and aside, say business as well, like we provide consulting services, that consulting services for small businesses and solopreneurs, to kind of all geared towards, you know, helping businesses and solo operators to work more effectively and efficiently, you know, with the idea, like, so that we can help them facilitate having better, like, financial and organisational outcomes. So yeah, it’s, um, I love it, I love, you know, rolling up the sleeves, and I’m working one on one and actually going to businesses to, to really review what’s already in place. And, you know, I just identify, help them identify, and obviously, with my input as well, but just if inefficiencies and our business and like areas for like improvement, you know, we help implement systems and processes and even policies, just to really assist with, like, streamline and all of the finance and administrative functions.
Hayley Quinn 6:57
Yeah, fantastic. So you’ve gone into bookkeeping. I mean, you did a double degree when, when we were at uni together. But have you always had an interest in sort of numbers and business? Because you did psychology as well. So what sort of took you down the path of starting your own bookkeeping business?
Donna Gilmour 7:14
I have always loved numbers. No, it’s just, I remember, you know, I’ve been, honestly, it let you laugh. I’ve been budgeting from a very, very early age, I’ve always loved Tiger’s eye, like, it’s just, it’s just something that I’ve just kind of always been good at. And even though like I’ve always been in business, you know, it’s, you know, I was a buyer, you know, it was a, you know, a buyer. You know, when I started started my career, so I was being kind of Finance and Administration procurement, that is always involved numbers across the way, you know, or, you know, I’ve been an assistant accountant, been a finance administrator. I just, I just really, really love working with factors. And even though, you know, I did the business degree, that was really the degree that I did, it was an accounting degree, I started off doing that, and really, really enjoyed it. And then, you know, I was locked in at uni and loved learning, you know, I’m just, I’m a lifelong learner. So, you know, when they the opportunity came up to do the psychology degree, I was very excited about doing that too, and just combined them.
But, you know, that just wasn’t the path. At the end of my studies, that wasn’t the path that I took for a variety of a variety of reasons. I don’t I don’t regret it. But I just went back to business and went back to went back to numbers and went back to working in finance departments. And it’s just one of my strengths. Just, I absolutely love it. I love everything about it.
Hayley Quinn 8:52
I can see it and hear it. And you and I’m very glad that you chose to do this psychology degree because I got to meet a beautiful friend through that. And I love that you then realise that actually, my strengths are with my numbers. That’s where I feel at home. That’s where I want to be, and you’ve gone on to build a business, and you’re an absolute whiz with systems and processes. Why do you think these are so important?
Donna Gilmour 9:15
Oh, thank you for saying that. I just Well, you know, everybody that people will see what our systems and processes nothing first, like I think we need to separate the two in terms of what systems and processes actually are because they’re often use the term systems and processes they’re often used interchangeably, but they’re really quite distinct from one another. And I always kind of pull it back to the context of a business because systems is huge. You know, you think of systems it’s, you know, the healthcare system, the skill and system, but always kind of bring it back to the context of business and I think systems you know, airfares. To like a structured and coordinated, you know, like arrangement of your people, your processes, your resources, and your tech, your tech that now all of that combined together to achieve like a specific purpose, specific business objectives of goals, you know, it really involves like the integration of various elements to create, like efficient workflows and streamline operations and ensure effective management of your tasks, your information, your resources within your business is really broad. The system is the big, the big thing. It’s like a bookkeeping systems, it’s huge. But I think processes on the other hand, you know, I think like the typically focus on the head, it’s like a series of tasks or steps that need to be followed to achieve whatever that outcome as like they became their current nonlinear linear order.
You know, there’s a really good quote, which I think just really nails systems. I don’t know, Michael I think his name’s Michael Gerber. Galbraith, thank you wrote that book, the E Myth revisited. Have you read that?
Hayley Quinn 11:09
I haven’t read it, but I’ve heard of it.
Donna Gilmour 11:11
He is a huge systems guy, huge. And a lot has caught. That’s just, it’s just some some setup for me. And what he says when and in particular to business, you’ve got to organise around your business functions, not your people, you build your systems, you own a business, the owner belts are on systems within each of your business functions. So you let the system run the business, and people run the systems.
Because Because honestly, people come and go, but the systems mean constant. So I really, I think that really sums it up, like I have worked.
You know, and, you know, not even just through my own career working for different companies, but running my own practice now and been able to actually work alongside business owners and actually go in, you know, go out on site and see how the business is operating. And you’d be surprised, you know, like, I worked.
I worked for Veolia water for many, many, many years. And I really loved that job. Heaps experience for that job, like I was assistant accountant was an office manager.
You know, I looked after some admin stuff on all the different sites, and we have a, we had a wonderful leader in there, he was amazing, I’ll never forget him.
And I was always, you know, I’m always trying to improve things. And, you know, which is something that I just naturally want to do a hate waste, I hate time waste, there’s a quicker and more efficient way to do it, it’s like my brain is geared to find it. And I remember him saying, you know, you kind of get a natural flavour for this, because, you know, I used to actually do like the monthly claim, it was like huge claims, not just like a couple of 100, there’s millions of dollars. So there was a whole system behind that. And I said, now that there are certain areas within this, it can be really sped up. But you know, we’re quite an efficient and the system.
And I remember him saying, you know, regarding systems and processes, and how much he thought there were so important for businesses, but he says there are actually systems and processes that he said equate they’re actually easy to implement. They’re easy to come up with, but it’s actually getting your staff to follow them. That is the hardest part. And not always, and I’ve seen that I’ve seen companies that have got really good systems and the staff just don’t follow them. I think that’s the biggest issue with systems but
I think they’re really important. They’re really everybody in the company needs other business needs systems are really important.
Hayley Quinn 13:51
So what would you say the biggest advantages of having systems in place and what might be some of the pitfalls if you didn’t have them?
Donna Gilmour 13:58
Are there’s lots there’s lots of advantages. One for me, I’m going to take you back Hayley. When did where were we skill? When were we you know, what, how many years ago was that? Hang on? I’ll look at my degree. Where did we granted I graduate? I think 15 years ago,
Hayley Quinn 14:21
at least, at least more than I was thinking about it the other day, and my boy was very little. So I started in 2003. So depending on what year I was in, yeah, we met Yeah, anyway, many many years ago. We start
Donna Gilmour 14:41
No, you know, you’re really introduced me to mnemonic try. And honestly, I probably to be really relaxed probably wouldn’t have gotten the grades that I got, if it wasn’t for mnemonics.
Hayley Quinn 14:58
Just for people listening mnemonics is a way of actually remembering content, Donner and I used to have a lot of fun and a lot of laughs with me coming up with the most ridiculous sayings to remember. We had to work on our exams.
Donna Gilmour 15:17
And I bet Haley with your Brilliant memory, you probably remember some of them. But that’s for another another time. But if you think of IT systems, I always like I don’t know where I saw this, but it was brilliant. And it really reminded to you many of you that if you actually write out the word systems, or you quit your issue, why are sute or M, your s, and I saw it on Instagram somewhere, and it said system, so it’s got systems save you space, time, energy, money. And from feeling stress, I thought that was glowing. And I always go back to that, I think, I think for me, the biggest advantage for businesses is the save you time and money. Yeah. You know, you design them, you design them to, to eliminate unnecessary steps. And, you know, you design them so that you’re reducing, like duplication of efforts, that’s the biggest one of the biggest ones for me. And I’m really huge and being organised. And businesses, you know, just the time that you can waste if you’re not organised, it’s just, it’s just very, very costly to businesses. So both systems are really allow you to let the foster been organised in your business, you know, they provide a kind of like a, like a framework, like a structured framework and process that and processes that help. You know, the business owner, the company, the staff, individuals in your company, like the Manage representative, they’ve got to do you know, whatever that is the tasks though. They help you manage your information and your your resources.
Hayley Quinn 17:12
You know, who doesn’t want to save time and money and just thinking as well, even if you don’t have staff, I mean, if you’re, if you’re a solo operator, I mean, saving yourself time is going to be so important, isn’t it? And also helping prevent burnout?
Donna Gilmour 17:28
Oh, of course, of course you need them, you know, you need them appear if you’re a sole operator, you need, you know, I use a metronome I use, I use them in my life. Yeah, I’m, you know, we’re all busy. But, you know, I guess going back to, you know, the importance of them as well, they’re really facilitate efficiency and consistency in your business. But you’ve got, you know, you’ve all got different tasks, we all will do, we will roll into industries and have different tasks. But when when you’ve got your tasks and they’re getting carried out, and the follow on whatever established systems are in place, or the end result is predictable, you’re not as to your standards to high standard, you know, the facilitate growth and your business. And even if you have you are a sole operator, and you’ve got really good systems and processes in your business, and you get to a point where you want to grow your business, you want to take on more staff, you want to provide more services, or whatever that is, you know, well defined systems and systems and processes are scalable, that helps to make things easier for your business to grow.
Absolutely delegate things, you know, they allow for for, for delegation, but I think, you know, I’ll come back to some more, I guess why they’re really important, I think. And this is huge. It’s, for me, anyway, the riches, stress, you know, to increase clarity in your business. You know, business can be hard, it can be stressful, and if you you know, you’re coming up to work and you you know, you don’t know what you do, and you’ve got everything everywhere you don’t know where to start, it’s really makes it hard to not only you but you’re taken on staff to understand how they need to perform the tasks. And you know, think that clarity and that reduced stress, it really promotes like out like an organised and calm working environment.
Hayley Quinn 19:26
I think he makes some really good points there. I can attest to that. With the systems in place. I’ve just recently employed the wonderful Ruby. And she’s doing a lot of the back end on the on the podcast. And I have that all set out of exactly how that has to be done. So it was a case of giving her the document and saying, Okay, let’s just sit together and go through this once and now she just, she’s just able to do that because there is a very consistent system in place for how this needs to be done. And I’m sort of looking at, okay, where else does that need to happen so I can delegate other jobs. As well, but that sense of don’t start with overwhelm. If you’ve got no systems in place, you’ve kind of starting from a place of overwhelm, aren’t you?
Donna Gilmour 20:08
Yes, yes, absolutely. And you know, there certainly can be so changeable over time to when I was working for different companies over the years and you know, some of them had quite good systems, but you can do in your job and think, Man, this can be done, this can be done better. And then you just implement other systems or you might have a systems in place system in place that worked really well. But tech comes along and changes things and you know, you can just improve that system but But I think ultimately, as well, systems are just really good for your customers or good for your clients. You know, consistent delivery of services or products or whatever it is through well established systems and processes that really improved that leads to client satisfaction and retention. And our clients are all businesses, right? Yeah, clients know what to expect and they can really rely on a company that can deliver consistently now by use my you’re trying to add context by use my bookkeeping and bass services practice as an example. You know, we’ve got weekly, fortnightly, monthly, quarterly annual tasks, you know, we’ve got some clients who reconcile weekly, some reconcile fortnightly some monthly, I’m now going to go back to weekly because I think that’s just best practice. That, you know, we’ve got some payroll clients and, you know, their payroll can be done weekly, fortnightly, sometimes all in different days. You know, we’ve got all of our compliance requirements, we’ve got bass, you know, we’ve got clients who resubmit bass n as monthly and quarterly, and superannuation. Someone played some quarterly, you know, there’s a whole host of annual tasks too. So compliance driven and debt driven. You know, we’ve got into month tasks, you know, your bookkeeping, just, just, you know, you just don’t get to the end of the quarter and everything’s done. Hey, there’s actually a very systematic approach to bookkeeping, with end of month bank and credit card reconciliations, and you’ve got to review, you’ve got to repair you’ve got to watch the boss. You know, a lot of bookkeepers work within the balance sheet for most companies. So we reconcile all GST long accounts, that just doesn’t happen. Just when you just turn up to work is very systemized. It’s very data driven.
And that for me, maybe when I was starting off and didn’t have very many clients, I could maybe remember dates because the dates you know, you remember when things need to be submitted. But as you grow those deadlines, those amount of clients that you service, it’s just too much to remember, it’s just not practical or practical. To run your business from your head, you’ve just got to have good systems.
Hayley Quinn 23:05
Having them allows you to run things efficiently, not having them could lead to actually missing whether it whether it’s whether you’re a bookkeeper, whether you’re a different type of service provider, could lead you to missing really important aspects of things that need to be done and deadlines that need to be met, which like say, could lead to customer dissatisfaction could lead to you losing customers, or could lead you to actually having to spend more money getting things fixed up and sorted out, which isn’t gonna get his business.
Donna Gilmour 23:35
Now now. You know, we’ve got our own kind of bookkeeping, you’re going back to systems, we’ve got our own bookkeeping system, and it’s just as the system that organises and streamlines our entire end to end bookkeeping processes. You know, we, that’s pretty structured. It’s very precise. You know, bookkeeping is very, very precise is best, just as a best practice approach to bookkeeper consultant. My clients always know that the records are correct and up to date, when as a business owner manage and a bookkeeping practice. I know that the bookkeeping for my clients is done the same way every day. You know, I’ve got a particular way that I do bookkeeping, you know, I can’t remember who who’s who said this, but I’m just just one of one of my colleagues. Have you put five keepers in the same room and ask them how asked them all to do the same task, guarantee that all that all that they will all do it differently? I don’t want none. I want bookkeeping done to the best practice and the way that I want bookkeeping done. So, you know, particular kind of like software that’s built into this system. It’s got tasks, templates, checklists, streamlines a whole entire bookkeeping process.
Hayley Quinn 24:50
I giggle to myself as you’re talking because you say bookkeeping is very precise, but I talked to so many women business owners, where their bookkeeping is not precise. In fact, their book keeping stresses them out immensely. They hate it, they don’t like numbers, or it’s just not the way their brain works. And I think, you know, either working out ways to put some systems in place, or actually, like I’ve done with you, I don’t want to do I do a little bit of my zero reconciling. But ultimately, it’s like, you are my numbers, girl, I love you for it, I don’t want to be thinking about all that. It’s like, I’ll do the things I can do. And I know, I’ve got you to be able to say, Okay, there’s some notes in Xero. Over to you, thank you very much. Because a lot of people find it really stressful.
Just to move on a little bit from that is, what do you think would be some areas that might be helpful for our listeners to think about, both within their work, but also in terms of their personal admin, like maybe some, just some little key areas that they could be thinking about, these will be good areas to sort of set up some processes or systems for themselves.
Donna Gilmour 26:01
Um in terms of of book keeping or?
Hayley Quinn 26:05
I mean, you kind of do more than that as well down here, in terms of the way you think and strategize with stuff. So I know you’ve talked before about making sure all the all the passwords are in place together and different sort of things where you’re kind of managing kind of either work or life admin, where some of this kind of more strategic thinking could be helpful.
Donna Gilmour 26:29
Yeah, like, I think, you know, as a tech world these days, I think we’re really lucky to live in a time when there’s so many great apps and software platforms that can really help you maximise efficiency and minimise waste in your business.
You know, I think some of the systems to get down part straightaway that will save you time and money in which allows us to really look at your financial management aspects of your business. And I just got to be really cheeky here, had bookkeeper. Now, it’s wise advice, I think, coming first, and that really stresses you, like, I’ve got clients Hayley that most of them, I’m end to end for them. It’s a minority of clients that like to do a little bit of it themselves. I’ve got clients who don’t even go in and look at it, they just let me deal with it. That one, it’s not, it doesn’t play to their strengths. Like they didn’t want a business to be a bookkeeper, you got a business and you’ve got all these hearts to where you started up your business. And, you know, bookkeeping, it’s not a strength that a lot of people have. So I would say, if you can afford to outsource your bookkeeping, take that hat off. Because the bookkeeper and or the bookkeeping practice, they’ve got all worked out the systems already there. I’d say take that hat off immediately. I, you know, I’m pretty- You know, I like working with tech, I like the software that can really help to just save your time, not only in your business, but save you time and your personal life too. And I’ll tell you what, the biggest two time-sucks I have ever seen. And all the businesses that I’ve worked with is not having a password management system. Yeah. And I mean, it’s huge. I would hate to actually put a cost on it for some of the businesses that I’ve worked in that where you go in and the passwords are on post it notes stuck to the screens or they’ve got an Excel spreadsheet with the passwords and the change that so many times and it’s you know, sometimes you can’t even read the password. I’ve seen business owners not even been able to get into their own systems because some of their staff have changed passwords you know, that are a game changer. And it’s you would think having a password manager that simple and as simple just implement that there’s lots of password management systems out there like I use one password I normally use it for my business I use it for my life.
You think of everything that you need the password for these days. Yeah, no I you know just to give you a little bit of background I’ll be quick with this. I had a client who- And not to say this like I kinda when she told me I saw goodness like she is beautiful, beautiful client, a lover. She likes to go on and do some on site work with her and see if she had a passwords all on an Excel spreadsheet at some point and she had a lot of traffic coming in. She has a retail business lot of traffic coming in And I’m looking at I’m seeing the Excel spreadsheet on the day. So I’m like, Oh, my goodness, let’s it, you know, she would be maybe turned away and somebody could pick up that and all the passwords around it. Well, she got hacked. You know, she got hacked about a couple of months ago. And it was, you know, it really stressed her out late to the point where she had massive anxiety over it. And she called me up and she said, Okay, I’m listening, you know, can you come in? Can you set this up and listen, yeah, it’s one of those jobs, it’s, you know, if you’ve not got a system in place, and when you operate a business, and you’ve got, let’s say, you’ve got 150 Plus passwords, it’s not quick to go on it. It’s not like a day’s work. It’s a few days work. And I went in there, and I said, Okay, I’m going to work here, I’m going to sit alongside with you. Because when you’re updating passwords, you’re having to go into the backend systems and update them.
But I implemented one password for her, I got it all on a computer, she works on all of our products, it takes all Apple, iPads, iPhones, she’s got multiple stuff. You know, I set it up in a way that will give her staff access to the passwords that they needed. They don’t get our Excel spreadsheet with all our other passwords, their your private and confidential information.
So that is one thing that can really, really help you save time if you like, you’re gone. But you just happen to all of us, right? We go on and we try and find the password we put password then and no, that’s not the password. You’re like, oh, what’s the password? And then you have your reset passwords, passwords. That takes time. And time, my friend is money?
Hayley Quinn 31:42
Absolutely. Can I just clarify, when you say one password, that’s the name of the app, right? You’re not actually using one password across everything.
Donna Gilmour 31:51
Like I’ve used various ones in the past, I’ve used LastPass don’t use LastPass anymore, I got on to I’ve got a really good IT guy that I work with. And he said come off, what am LastPass and then go on to One Password. So I set everything up on one password. And it’s just it’s really intuitive, really intuitive. And one password has never been hacked LastPass I’m sure they’ve had some kind of problem in the past. It just securely stores and manages your passwords a great system to put in place you will save time immediately. Yeah.
You know, another one where there’s just huge waste. And it’s just your documents, your digital file and and you don’t document management systems. And there’s lots of cloud storage systems out there. Like I use OneDrive, I use it for business, I use it for life information, as Google Drive Dropbox, that really helps you to store and organise all your docs, and your photos or files, like everything that you really need in your day to day operations. So that you’re you’re not having to waste time, you know, navigating different systems and locations to find what you’re looking for, like her soul destroying a site trying to find a document you don’t know where you’ve put it. You know, I’m fairly structured and organised that way with my dogs. I think I read it was an Australian study. So don’t quote me. I can’t remember who who did it. But the Study of Australian businesses, and I think they said employees on average, lose a half hour a day looking for documents, because they’re just they’ve lost on they’ve not filed them properly. And then they spend another half an hour recreating that document that the last us an hour ID parent was weak.
Hayley Quinn 33:40
If you’re working five days a week, that’s nearly a whole day’s work. Or we can you imagine that? Just roughly just so you can for employees? Who are on average have bought a box to say 40 bucks an hour? Yeah. Just to the less than half an hour a day.
What’s that? Yeah, 40 employees $40 a day, two and a half hours away and a half hour the dollars a week?
Donna Gilmour 34:05
Now times that by four
Hayley Quinn 34:10
$192,000 I’m only being conservative here. That’s a lot half an hour of the having to take half an hour recreating the document double that? Yeah.
Donna Gilmour 34:23
Huge.
Hayley Quinn 34:24
So these things, I mean, just the point of this is these systems are really important. Hey, even if it’s only for yourself, if you’re spending five hours a week that you could be spending seeing a client’s or doing something else that’s going to make you some money in your business. This is really really important stuff isn’t it as it can be pretty anal about things you know, I even a keystroke for me.
Donna Gilmour 34:53
You see if I can use Mike reduce my keystrokes that’s time. Time is everything is but you know. We’re running businesses. We’ve got a life, we’ve got kids to raise, we’ve got our personal life, we’ve got dogs to walk, we’ve got food to meet, we’ve got, you know, I’ll do anything to save time. I’m a business, man, everyone can do it. It’s not like people say I’m not organised. And I’m just not the organised tonight. And I really think you’re not born. Without a belay, I think it can be learned is the right tech, if you can make yourself to being organised, have you put systems in place in your business that facilitate that, you know, you’ll get really good at it. And when you start building it into money of what you’d lose, and like you say, yeah, it’s not only that staff member losing all that money in time, but that time can be used elsewhere in your business to earn your money. You know, getting your money through the door revenue and revenue activities.
Hayley Quinn 35:54
So yeah, or you could be finishing up work earlier and going home to be with your family or going to do something that actually brings you some joy outside of work. So I mean, I think you know, it’s time and space and money, isn’t it? You run your own business, you assist with your partner’s business, you have a parenting role as well. You’ve got lots of different hats to wear. What do you find is the biggest challenge in being a working parent? Because I think a lot of people listening are working parents, and how do you take care of yourself? How do you try to take care of yourself?
Donna Gilmour 36:34
Um, yes, try. It’s challenging. And it’s always a work in progress for me, you know, I think I think the biggest challenge for me, always comes back to, you know, just finding a really healthy balance between work, family, and self. When people say, oh, there’s no such thing as a mess, work life balance, but you know, I think the juggling everything can be really demanding. And I don’t always get it, right. And I’m still really trying to find that sweet spot. But it’s, it’s hard. You know, I think running running a business really requires a lot of your time and a lot of commitment that, you know, and I’ve chosen this for myself, I’ve chosen to run my own business. So that’s with me, but, you know, sometimes you just don’t get to clock off at five, you know, when you’re, especially when you’re in that building phase, and you’re really trying to, you know, make your business work better. But, you know, I love being a business owner. All of that sometimes. I know, I know, this is it doesn’t doesn’t sound good, but I sometimes I don’t prioritise self care I have in the past been quite notoriously bad at this, but I am improving because I really realise you know, you’ve self care, you know, it’s, it’s really different for all of us. You know, we all know intellectually that we’ve got to eat well, we’ve got to exercise we’ve got to get enough sleep. It’s essential for overall health and well being you know, and that’s, you know, I’ve really tried to always get that get get that right. But I also like to incorporate other self care activities into my life that fill my cup and restore me you know, you know me Hello, I’m introverted. I’m actually really quiet and quite shy. So relaxation for me is really been able to carve out time for me. And I don’t mean this to sound selfish. I love my family. I love spending time with my family. I’ve got a beautiful son You know, I’ve got a lovely partner we love to go away and, and camp and do all this family things. You know, at the end of the year, we always take a two year break, but I need time for me I need I need that kind of those solitary activities. And sometimes I get I love getting away from my friends too.
You know, I love doing solitary things. You know I love just been setting in whether it’s something simple like reading a book or, or just been able to go to the shops and you’re not getting rushed or chemical No, like, you know, just all those things that really, I guess, really fill my cup my cup up and restore my energy. But I don’t always get it right. I don’t but we are getting better, or really I’m getting there.
Hayley Quinn 39:40
And I think I think the work life balance can be a tricky kind of phrase that we use. I think it’s more of a blend of what we have to do. I don’t know that we find balance balance will kind of mean there’s these two things in equal status. And I don’t think we can do that. I think we have a blend of, you know, work life and ourself and And then people that have listened to the podcast or follow my work know that for me, I think self care really is this this deeper, more courageous thing that we do where we’re in relationship with ourselves in a very different way. And it sounds like you do you tune into what you actually need as an individual. And yes, we need to eat well, we need to sleep well. And that’s going to mean different things for different people as well. And how much other stuff we need is going to be very unique to who we are and how we operate in the world. So I think it is that thing of understanding yourself better getting to know yourself better, certainly prioritising that, where we can make such a difference and how it has for me in my life, and the women that I work with. So and remembering where we’re not always going to get it right. There’s just no way in the world that we can do that. It’s just doing what you can and to
Donna Gilmour 40:52
That is very true. And I love a phrase that you use, you know, we’re human first.And I think for women, as well as actually giving yourself permission to stop. And I think we’re all I don’t think we’re all good at that, you know, we we serve we you know, we’ve got businesses we serve our clients, we serve our family, you know, I know sometimes I’ve really put myself to the backburner and even the little things like, you know, in the mornings, you know, I’ve got a 12 year old got got to get him out the door. But you know, he’s getting better at it, no, but got to get his lunch prepared. And that is something I’ve started doing now I’ve kind of reverse that, I get myself ready for snow, and I prepare my lunch first. And then you know, I’m getting body as getting good at starting to, you know, organise all his lunch anyway, I’ve still got a, you know, he likes me making sandwiches and things like that. But, you know, previously, I would sometimes be run into work. And because I’ve been looking after everybody else, I’ve forgotten about myself. I don’t do that anymore. It’s like I’ve got a mic cut, I’ve got to look after myself, too. So that’s why I just don’t know, I just go no, I need time out. I need time away. I need to look after myself.
Hayley Quinn 42:19
Oh, as you know, I’m extremely passionate about helping women find sustainable ways of living and working so that you can have a thriving business and that you’re thriving yourself. You’re not giving everything to everybody else. And then you’ve got nothing left for yourself. Yes, I think when that happens is business isn’t fun at all. It’s just really hard work.
Donna Gilmour 42:42
No, it’s not. It’s no, it’s just I’ve always failed. There’s a book I can’t remember the author’s called. It’s called the Russian women’s Central. And that was me. It really was me you’re running about, trying to get everything done. But you know, and I thought no, I can’t I can’t do this anymore. Like, quite an anxious person as it is like it was good. It was making me more anxious. You know, you’ve got to just decompress a little bit and really carve out that time for yourself. So important. And I am, you know, I am getting better at it.
Hayley Quinn 43:15
So my greatest life, greatest life hack, slow down, slow down your breath. And let your wisdom emerge.
Donna Gilmour 43:25
Yes, that’s beautiful. I love that, man.
Hayley Quinn 43:28
So if you were starting your business from scratch again tomorrow, is there anything that you do differently?
Donna Gilmour 43:38
Ah, yes. Alison, I loved it. I loved all my business. It was so exciting. Even though the challenges that come with opening a business, you know, we’ve gotta wear all these hats. And they don’t always play to our strengths for me. I think I was quite fortunate because, you know, my background is finance to ministry in administration not done at all nearly all my working life, I guess. So that side of the business was relatively easy for me like I know bookkeeping, I know compliance under software, A New Hope, streamline and organise my business. But other areas like marketing it growth. You know how to actually be a business owner. They were challenging for me, I spent way too much time trying to figure all those areas out by myself and I still haven’t got it all worked out. And I’m not since in years, you know, everything is fantastic. And I’m still in my own way, trying to be a business owner and not work so much in the business. But I think one thing for me I probably wish I would have done is engaging a business coachor enrolled in a coaching programme that was really specific to running a bookkeeping business. Because the amount of time that I’ve actually put into my business and made so many mistakes, and, you know, I’ve taken the time and made that investment. I probably would be far better than I am right now. Yeah, I’m happy we were early on right now, you know, I believe in having a sustainable practice. But yeah, I probably would have done that, like, I knew that the technical knowledge and experience knew that I was driven. And I knew that I always wanted to run my business. But I struggled to try to do all I really did struggle in areas that I really knew nothing about, and should have just stayed well clear from, you know, this is embarrassing that I spent countless hours tinkering away with my website, coming up with a copy, and the amount of time that I just, you know, look to my logo and went Nope, don’t I don’t like this logo. I don’t like the colours like creating that website was horrendous. And I even took a mini course in Squarespace. I was never happy with it. That was just was not my strength. And I eventually, as the income started to come in my business, you know, I just made the investment and got this amazing web designer who did all of that for me, you know, and she’d really just did purchase all my brand. And you know, I’m happy with that. But I think it’s really it’s an investment, engage in someone, or a programme or a coach to really help facilitate and get a real good Kickstart to your to your business.
Don’t feel that you’ve got to do all by yourself, you’ve got to reach out, you know, that’s my biggest advice. I just, you know, I don’t like asking for help. It’s just, you know, I just I try and figure it out, I try and figure it all out myself. And that’s something that I’ve really had to like, relinquish. Because we all need help in different different ways. We’ve all got our unique skill set. But other areas, I just kind of outsource it. No, because I don’t have the time to tinker, which stresses me out when I don’t know what I’m doing. Data to someone else helped me looking at it
Hayley Quinn 47:30
I think you’ve made some really good points. I’ve worked with business coaches for a number of years now and find that really helpful. Obviously, I work as a business coach, and I love helping other women work with that. But I think having somebody to talk about ideas and look at your blocks as well. Yeah, one thing I’m gonna say which might people might find a bit Prickly, but you know, you’re saying that you’re tinkering with your logo, and you’re tinkering with the website. I think there’s tasks as business owners, particularly as women, that we spend all this time one because we don’t like asking for help, we find that hard. But also, some of that stuff can actually stop us stepping into our power and actually running our businesses properly. It gives us this, oh, I am doing something that needs to happen in my business. I am busy. I’m working hard. But I think part of it as well, is it’s an easier place because it helps keep you small. And I think as women as we have been taught, don’t take up space don’t have a voice certainly don’t be successful, powerful and make money. So I think some of that happens for women. And when we outsource, we make space and then it’s like, okay, well, this space now I need to be doing the things that are going to move my business forward.
Donna Gilmour 48:41
Oh, I love that. That’s so true. No, we do keep ourselves in a safe space. Yeah. No, it’s hard. It’s like, you know, it’s like impostor syndrome as well. Isn’t it all goes kind of goes back to that. Now, I really, really love that a lot.
Hayley Quinn 49:02
I’ve actually got an episode on impostor syndrome. That was a couple of episodes ago, and another one coming up in another few episodes. Because I think that is such a big topic that actually have two different women on talking about impostor syndrome. So go back and listen to that one, or listen out for the next one that’s coming as well. I think are really important. And think about this for a moment. And I invite the audience think about this for a moment. Is it easier for you to be tinkering with a task and telling yourself, Oh, I’m not very good at this. This is quite hard. This isn’t really my strength, or is it easier to stand out in public and say, I am really good at this. This is my strength, and you need me to come and help you do that. Now my guess is a lot of people would find it easier to be sitting there telling themselves they’re not very good at something.
Donna Gilmour 49:54
Yes. Yes.
Hayley Quinn 49:58
We have to be so aware of what is going on in these tricky minds, and thinking about what is it about my own history, that helps me make sense of why I struggle with some areas of my business? And then do your best to reach out and get support for that.
Donna Gilmour 50:16
Yeah, that’s beautiful Hayley really, really nice. Yeah. That’s so true. That’s so true. You know, I still have tough moments, I still have those moments where you start questioning yourself, you start questioning your belly, or he’s thinking, I’m not gonna be able to help that client that’s too hard, or that’s probably some for someone is a little bit more experienced than me. And, you know, during those times, I really start to, to challenge myself now and really put myself in that space and go, No, I’ve got to really remind myself, No, you know what you are doing, Donna, you know that you can help this client. So just put your big girl pants on, and go on do your stuff. But you know, I still have those moments. And I think we all do. We’re human first. Absolutely.
Hayley Quinn 51:05
And I think as your business grows, every time you get to a growth edge, along comes the discomfort and the questioning, and the self doubt, because you’re about to hit a growth edge. Yes. So you’ve got comfortable with where you’re at and who you’re helping and what you can do. And then your business starts to grow, or it might pivot or evolve in some way. And then there’s this thing again, of like, oh, but am I okay, for this next bit? I mean, I think that happens to all of us. I think this, I think if you spoke to some of the most successful people out there, they would say the same. Yes. You know, I think running your business isn’t just about growing a business, it’s about growing yourself as a human being as well.
Donna Gilmour 51:44
Oh, absolutely. The amount of growth that I feel that I have gone through, and all these years, and I’m still growing, and I love growth, but you know, you’re just not where it was two years ago, mindset wise, you know, business growth, like I’m always I just think it’s always good. As much as as uncomfortable as it is, you got to challenge yourself, you’ve got to put yourself in knows challenge and whatever space that is, you know, I had one client recently, very quickly say this, and, and I didn’t really want to take the client on initially, because sometimes you just get a bit of a feeling but, you know, she was actually she was quite desperate. And in the end, I just thought, you know, I feel a bit sorry for I can probably help a parent. But it was an on site job, which I don’t do a lot of but and there was just parts of it that I just wasn’t quite sure about, but then I thought not going you can help her and um, and, you know, it’s it’s been wonderful. I’ve really came out of that thinking, you know, you you very nearly said no to that claim, for whatever reason that was that out because I was personally feeling something myself about your confidence or ability. But here you are, you’ve gone in there, you’ve been able to really help this client that client is so grateful for you know, and you’re still working with that client now and you’re still helping and so I think go for it. You know, it may be you may be nervous to begin with, but always back yourself. Always back yourself.
Hayley Quinn 53:18
That’s what my husband’s always said to me. Just back yourself, Hayley, back yourself.
So if you could meet your 80 year old self, this is one of my favourite questions. I asked everybody if you can meet your 80 year old self, what do you think she’d say to you?
Donna Gilmour 53:33
That is a really emotional question. I’m gonna You’re gonna make me cry. On the podcast, oh my god, Haley, that is so emotional.
I think I think first of all, she would say good on you.
Get on you for all of your achievements in life. And for always backing yourself. I think she- she would encourage me to live without regrets, to take risks. And to always try and make decisions that are aligned with my true desires. Yeah, I think you know, be the be probably a final message to say always look after yourself and your health, and that your mental and physical well being will always be your biggest priority. Mm hmm.
Hayley Quinn 54:56
Very wise, your 80 year old self.
Donna Gilmour 54:58
Yes. Oh, my goodness, asked me questions like that.
Hayley Quinn 55:03
And I think it can be really a really good exercise for us to check in along the way, you know, what would my 80 year old self say to me about this particular situation, or, you know, this choice I’m about to make or how I’m going, you know, particularly when we’re feeling like, we’re not going so well, because I think we, you know, one of the things I do in my group with women business owners is we focus on celebration as well. Because I think as women particularly we don’t do that we don’t shout from the rooftops, when we’ve done something great. We don’t tell people when we’ve got little wins or big wins. So that’s something I encourage a lot. And I think when we connect with our future self, we can often connect with all that stuff, like you said, Good on you for all the achievements you’ve had through life. And they’ve been so many. I mean, I’ve been very fortunate to witness a lot of them. And it’s been a beautiful journey. Oh, thank you. Thank you so much, that has. So finally, if Well, finally, before I ask you the very last question, if people want to find out more about your get in touch, where can they find you engage with your work, make contact, I’ll put them in the show notes as well.
Donna Gilmour 56:21
Just jump on the website, you know, there’s a contact form on the website that come that comes through to me, so just the websites www.timenspace.com.au. So that’s T I M, E, N, S, P, A, C E.com.au.
I can be emailed as well, if you want to email me at info at time and space.com.au.
Or just call me, I can be called on my mobile number. So 0425403411. Now, it might not always get to the call straightaway. Because you know, I do, like, client work, you know, but I’ll always get back to you.
Hayley Quinn 57:04
And hopefully have good boundaries around that. So you’re not always going to reply straightaway. Because you’ve got good boundaries in your business.
Donna Gilmour 57:10
Yes, you know, when I am in a client’s file, that’s where my brain is. That’s where my focus is. So I don’t try and minimise as many interruptions as possible when I’m in flow.
Hayley Quinn 57:24
So if you were to able, if you were able to give one piece of advice, what is it that you’d like our listeners to most take away from what we’ve talked about today?
Donna Gilmour 57:36
Probably be like run businesses, not a science. There’s not a one size fits all approach. I think find out what works for you and your style and run with that.
Hayley Quinn 57:49
Yeah, fantastic.
You know, I think that would be would be my my biggest message. Yeah. You know, there’s not there’s a lot of people will say, No, you can’t do it this way. Or you’ve got to do it. That way of you’ve got you don’t got to do it anyway. But the way that you want to do, you might need a little bit of help with that you might need, you know, someone coming in and maybe helping you around that. But it’s not I don’t think it’s a one size fits all approach.
Yeah, absolutely. I’d fully agree. Donna, it’s been an absolute pleasure. I’m sure there’s lots of people to think about. Lots of things they can think about in terms of what they’re going to do to put some systems and processes in place for their business. Obviously, if anyone wants to reach out to you.
I’ll put the details in the show notes. It’s been an absolute pleasure having you on the podcast. And thank you again for coming on.
Donna Gilmour 58:43
Thank you so much, Hayley, for having me on. I am so grateful for that. It’s been it’s been awesome. And I was so nervous and I don’t even feel nervous. No, it’s good. That’s fantastic. Lovely to see you talk again soon. Okay, speak to you soon.
Hayley Quinn 59:05
Thank you for sharing this time with me today, I hope your time here was helpful and supportive. If there has been something in this episode that you have found helpful, I invite you to share it with another person you think might benefit. If you’ve benefited in any way from the podcast, please do me a favour and show my pod some love by giving it a five-star rating and review. Ratings, reviews and shares really help to increase awareness and reach of the podcast, meaning I can spread helpful information more widely. All reviews are welcome and much appreciated as I know they take time out of your day. If you’d like to be notified when the next episode airs, please use the link in the show notes to join my mailing list. If you have any particular topics you’d like to learn more about or guests you’d like to hear from, please reach out and let me know. I’d love to hear from you. Music and editing by Nyssa Ray, thanks Nyssa. I wish you all well in your relationship with yourself and your business and may you go well and go gently.
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